Episode Info
- Season15
Hosted by Christina Ruffini and Sir Richard Dearlove
Guest
Johanna Maska
Johanna Maska is a former Director of Press Advance at the White House during the Obama administration who shares an insider view on the personal side of Joe Biden and campaign style.
Episode Summary
Former Director of Global Engagement in the Obama White House, Brett Bruen joins to host our weekly special One More Decision to provide analysis on President Joe Biden's announcement—that at 80 years old he will seek another term as president setting up a potential Trump vs. Biden rematch in 2024. Brett speaks with Johanna Maska, the former Director of Press Advance at the White House during the Obama administration. Maska shares an insider view on the personal side of Joe Biden, what makes him tick, insights on his campaign style and how staffers made sure he stayed on script. And how will the world view a potential Biden vs Trump rematch, and if a divisive presidential election poses the greatest threat to the US.
Listen & Subscribe
- Watch on YouTube
- Listen on Apple Podcasts
- Listen on Spotify
Transcript
INTRODUCTION
Mcfarlane: I'm Julia McFarlane, host of One Decision, the podcast that looks at the choices made that shape our world. Together with my cohost, the former chief of British intelligence, Sir Richard Dearlove, we unpack the key decisions, past, present, and future, that matter to us all. We drop new episodes every Thursday. But today, we're bringing you One More Decision, smart analysis of the latest breaking news around the world with Global Situation Room president Brett Bruen, who served as the White House director of global engagement during the Obama administration. Over to you, Brett.
Bruen: Thanks, Julia. We sit here literally in the shadow of the US Capitol, the week that president Joseph R. Biden Junior declared at 80 years old, he's ready for another term. NEWS CLIP [0:50] Freedom. Personal freedom is fundamental to who we are as Americans. There's important, nothing more sacred. That's been the work of my first term, to fight for our democracy. This shouldn't be a red or blue issue. To protect our rights, to make sure that everyone in this country is treated equally, and that everyone is given a fair shot at making it. But, you know, around the country, MAGA extremists are lining up to take on those bedrock freedoms.
INTERVIEW
Bruen: To break down this decision, we have former Obama administration official, Johanna Masca. She's a national political commentator here in the US and a colleague of mine. You've heard her on the podcast before. Johanna, welcome once again.
Masca: Thank you.
Bruen: I wanna delve into the personal side of Biden, one that you got to know six years working with him in those crowded corridors of the West Wing. He's a stubborn guy.
Masca: Mhmm.
Bruen: And yet at the same time, one could say he's got a lot of stick-to-it-ness, which is on display this week.
Masca: Yeah. You know, Biden announced he's running for president again via video. I guess we're gonna try to win this election with filters and fonts. But, yeah, I got to know Biden after president Obama selected him to be his vice president. So we were announcing his joining the ticket, and after that announcement, we took him back to Scranton, Pennsylvania. And I remember we were a very disciplined campaign. You know, remember by then we'd beat Hillary Clinton, which took a lot of determination and organization. And so we had people on the trail who were supposed to follow him around and make sure that he read from the teleprompter. And that's not really Biden's style. He doesn't read from the teleprompter. So literally there was someone who would scribble exactly what he was saying and send it back into the campaign office to make sure, you know, it wasn't going too far afield. And I don't think he liked being told what to do. I got to know him better, of course, in the administration because he would host really big press parties. He's a typical politician who loves engaging with people. Barack Obama was more cerebral. Joe Biden is very much people. People give him oxygen. So he would, you know, go out and invite all the media to come to the Naval Observatory, the vice president's residence, and he would go around and get all the kids together and get water guns and give them all water guns, and they'd all run around and, you know, shoot people with water guns, and that's what he loves doing. You know, now he's president, 80 years old, so it's been a while since I was hanging with him in the water guns, but he's decided he's not done. And I think he is very much that stubborn person who believes he does not need to stick to a script and that he knows exactly what he's gonna do. I'm not so sure. We'll see what happens with this election, but it'll go exactly as planned because he intends to run against Donald Trump, and we're not sure on the Republican side that that's going to be the case.
Bruen: I think a lot of people listening around the world are trying to understand why is no one else in the Democratic party, with the exception of two rather obscure candidates, putting themselves forward to offer an alternative when, according to the latest poll, 70% of Democrats say they prefer Biden doesn't run.
Masca: Yeah. And I think a lot of Americans are frustrated with their options also. They don't necessarily want a Trump v Biden. We're seeing that in the polls, and we're seeing that in terms of engagement with ordinary voters. That said, the US election system is one that's based on a financial model. And to win, you have to have money and oxygen. There are a lot of Democrats who are very reluctant to throw their hat in the ring because they believe that they would make Joe Biden a weaker candidate. They've seen that script before, and it has made him a weaker candidate against someone like a Trump. They're very nervous about — you know, January 6 was a monumental issue in America. We hadn't had a noose at the Capitol. We hadn't seen our Capitol under siege. That was a real defining moment, and so a lot of Democrats are saying they are not going to put Joe Biden in a position in which he could not win. On the Republican side, you're seeing Republicans come out to run against Donald Trump, but they're not coming out yet against Donald Trump. They're saying they agree with his policies, but they just don't agree with him as a person. Now I was part of the operation to take power from Clinton in the Democratic party because Obama was the upstart, and we beat Hillary Clinton. And we knew you have to run against Clinton, and we were, you know, determined to stab the stake through the heart. When the Republicans figure that out, they may have a good contender. I think most people around the world are wondering, why is this a two year election cycle?
Bruen: Well, and one important point there for the audience to bear in mind, December of 2007, Barack Hussein Obama, you're out in Iowa with him, is polling at 17%.
Masca: Yeah.
Bruen: Against Hillary Clinton. And we've already seen the ups and downs in the Republican primary. DeSantis deflating, maybe he can make a comeback, but we got a long way to go. And, obviously, people know Trump. Trump commands oxygen. Whether he can command votes again is an open question. But my last question to you is we are gonna have, irrespective of who the standard bearers are for either party, a very divisive election. What does that mean for the world? And at a time when we have war in Europe, when we have an increasingly aggressive China, when we have actors from Saudi Arabia all the way through to North Korea testing the limits, testing the norms of international order and traditions. Should we be worried? And as Bob Gates, the former defense secretary said on our podcast, the greatest threat to the United States is our own division.
Masca: I am still a political optimist. And I say that with all the evidence that people are post-COVID, you know, really having trouble coming together and finding solutions. But I've been out on the trail with Barack Obama for years and with other candidates, and Americans want to see America lead. They do care a lot about the rest of the world. I mean, Americans are philanthropists, they're generous, but there's some real trouble here that we have to solve for, which is real economic divisions. People are hurting. They feel like manufacturing jobs have left America. And in some cases, they did. I mean, Galesburg, Illinois, where I'm from, we lost manufacturing jobs. The candidate who can speak to that audience with some hope will emerge, and it may not be Joe Biden. I mean, Joe Biden will be the Democratic nominee, but you may see someone on the Republican side emerge who's different. I think, you know, the trouble is you're probably gonna see democracy's ugly side when this all starts going. But as painful as this is, and Morgan Ortagus and I were talking about this yesterday on NewsNation, she was Trump's state department press secretary. And, of course, I worked with president Obama traveling with him, setting up all of his events in 42 countries around the world. And the two of us both said, as ugly as democracy can be, we know that these freedoms to say what we want is something fundamental in the American DNA that we will continue to fight for. So whether it's seeing McCarthy go over to Israel, or seeing some of our other leaders say their positions, just know that to some degree with America, we still, I believe, like we did on January 6, we'll find our core, and I believe we'll be stronger in the future.
Bruen: And while I appreciate, Johanna, the optimistic note, one you always bring to an outlook that can at times seem bleak and cut half full, I worry one that we may see over the next year and a half efforts by adversaries who try to challenge this moment of doubt and division, democracy under threat. I wonder whether or not if we see another stop the steal movement started by whether it's former president Trump or another candidate, another political group, will we have both the stamina, the strength, the institutional resilience to push back against it? And then in the scenario where Trump or another Republican candidate wins, and likely in that scenario, you also see Republicans take control of one, if not both, houses of Congress. We have a very conservative majority on the Supreme Court. It is a very different America. And I think for the audience around the world, understanding that possibility, the possibility that the United States could look very different than we do today, even different from the days when Trump served in his first administration, is one to prepare for. One of the points when I was a couple weeks ago over in London was asking people on Ukraine. Are we ready? Is Europe ready to supplement if the US is not providing the aid? If we are no longer as resolute in our commitment to Ukraine or to NATO? I think those are open questions. We'll have to see, obviously, how the campaign unfolds and how the United States ultimately emerges.
CLOSING
Mcfarlane: That's it from this world update from the One Decision podcast. If you enjoyed this little conversation, why not check out our channel for our main offerings which drop every Thursday? Just search One Decision wherever you find your podcasts. From me and the team, thank you for listening, and see you next time.
